Harry Turner 00:09
Hello, hello hello welcome to another episode of Is that SO and remember is that SO is about equanimity. And it's also about dive in deeper, dive in deeper understanding who you truly are living in that truth that you discover. So being lit for life. So we all about embracing that lit effect going down this intentional route of self discovery, because no matter who you speak to, you can speak to a lot of people in different professions. And you will hear a range of experiences, some will say that they love the profession. Some will tell you that they regret being in their profession. But if you go down the road of self discovery, you will not find one person that will ever tell you that they regret going down the road of self discovery. And so a continuation of that theme where we're exploring the shadows this season season three of is that S we're exploring the shadows, I had to embrace it. And by recent guests back on, y'all familiar with our Miss Renee Bergman, functional health practitioner, and y'all can go to a website megaphone functional health.com, check it out on Instagram at megaphone functional health or at on Facebook at megaphone functional health. And if you're trying to get her on an email, it's Renee at megaphone functional health.com. We'll have these links at the bottom, no worries to those of y'all who are listening and driving. Alright, so without further ado, I'm going to invite Miss Renee in but she's come in today to talk about specifically the Enneagram. And how RAM can assist us in facing these shadows that appear to be so challenging at times that show up in triggered moments. And for me, it triggers no more than a trail, a trailhead for further exploration. And so my triggers when I do when I am triggered, I don't project that on to the other or on to the situation. I see it as an opportunity for me to explore something about myself. And so I give thanks for my trigger. No, it doesn't have to feel good for me to give thanks and have gratitude for it. That's the entire point of me saying this is that you don't have to wait for something pleasurable to give thanks, you can actually give thanks during the rain to knowing that the rain, the rainy seasons in your life is necessary. And that too will produce fruit and no fruit wouldn't be produced if it were not for that rain. So we are grateful for that. The Enneagram is one of those tools that are used to understand the terrain of your the terrain, excuse me of your heart on this path to self discovery. As I understand it, the longest distance any of us will overtake is the distance from our head to our hearts. Unfortunately, many of us will live and go to our grave with regrets. Because we've chosen or being born or being chosen every single day or choosing because we're all born to be outliers. All of us are born outliers, you can't find one person with the same set of fingerprints. We're all born to be outliers. So many of us outliers are realizing that we've been born to be an outlier in our choosing to lean into our truth, no matter how difficult it may be. The Enneagram is one of those tools for you to do that. And so on this show, I brought back my special guest, Rene Bergman. She's excellent y'all please, please go check her out, check us out I wouldn't have on the season definitely would have on here twice, if I didn't believe in him. But she's gonna talk to us about the Enneagram and how it really we're gonna explore my Enneagram I'll put my business out there for once. All right. I say For once, I don't know how much of my business out of me, but I put out there more than once. But the bottom line is we got to get deep in Harry row with his Enneagram because we're about to she's about to teach me about the Enneagram teach you all about the Enneagram by using my Enneagram as a case study. Hello, welcome. Welcome to the IS THAT SO show for the second time? Yeah. So glad to be back. I am. I'm so happy to have you here, sister. And just in case, people didn't tune in to the first one what you need to be tuning into if you have not done so yet because it was off the chain. Can you just give the people a little bit about yourself? Can you tell the people a bit about yourself?
Renee Bergmen 04:15
Absolutely. I'm a functional health practitioner. And I get to root causes of why people are struggling physically, with autoimmune disorders, hormone disruptions, gut dysfunction. But I do it in a pretty specific way. I use a lot of looking back at what your experience of experiences had been as a kid and in life and how that's impacted your body. So I know all of your listeners are really familiar with all this body keeping that score. We talked a ton about that on our first episode and just how much that body keeps that score. And so one of the tools that they use is the Enneagram and we just kind of barely touched on it last time a little bit about how to use the Enneagram. So we at the end decided let's go ahead and jump in and do a whole session. together talking about what the Enneagram is how it really age you and understanding your shadows and how that impacts your physical health and how to really merge all those worlds together.
Harry Turner 05:10
Seems as I need to add Renee as a co host on here, because she she introduced that Oh, my You killed that you killed. It killed it. I appreciate the intro. Like, I'm just I'm looking at a professional and I'm learning and I'm taking notes. I appreciate you just dive into it. All right. How do you feel today? First off,
Renee Bergmen 05:31
you know what? I'm feeling good. I am. I've had a crazy roller coaster of a day. But altogether, I have a brand new puppy in my house. Which who doesn't love a new puppy? Right? Come on. He's all snuggly, and he just wants to be up and lick your face all the time. So
Harry Turner 05:46
yes, I just want to show you love no judgment. Just love judgment.
Renee Bergmen 05:51
I did love you. Yeah.
Harry Turner 05:53
Oh, pets, pets, pets? Were human. Similar, right. But I believe we're moving to that stage and more we understand ourselves until the unconscious becomes conscious, it will direct our lives. And we will call it fate. Sister, you take it from here. Yeah. So
Renee Bergmen 06:08
the Enneagram. We talked a little bit about what the Enneagram was last time. So let me kind of give you a little basic understanding the Enneagram. It's a map for personal growth, it identifies nine different basic ways of relating to and perceiving the world. So Enneagram means any a nine and gram diagram. So it's a real simple nine diagram. So nine different numbers that you can kind of fall into. It accurately describes why you think, feel and behave in particular ways based upon your core motivations. So understanding the Enneagram has the power to give you more self awareness, more self forgiveness, and more compassion for yourself and others. So it really is not a lot of personality tests get to, here's all the things that you're really good at. And here's how you know you how the world takes you on and all of that. And those are really good tools, right? They really help us understand how we navigate in the world. But sometimes we need to really reflect and look inside and understand how we were created. And what made us be who we are. And so the Enneagram really helps untangle some of that it helps us understand our core fears, our core desires, our core weaknesses, and our core longings. And as you understand those, it helps you to move through these different paths of here's what happens when I'm really unhealthy. When I when I'm not doing okay, emotionally, here's what happens when I'm sort of, in a world of I can't, I can't deal with what's going on in my world, here's what happens in my number. But then here's what happens when I'm trying to grow when I'm trying to really change and see if I can have some parts of my life be untangled and feel unearthed in some of the hard things that have happened in my life. And here's what's happened when I converge. So I talked about a converging path as this path of, you've done a bunch of growth, now you're really converging and being able to integrate who you are into others around your world without taking on their stuff. But to do it in a really healthy, balanced way to live in harmonious relationships, being willing to allow conflict calm and work through that without it having you shut down, knowing that others function different ways than you and being able to really grow in that and see your relationships flourish. So it has incredible power, one of the things that I think would be so great for us. So first of all, I want people to understand what number you are, and then I kind of want to talk about childhood messages because I think this is a core piece to where we get our number and how that sort of impacts some of those shadows and the way that we interpreted life. And, and what that brought about. So you're a five on the Eneagram, that's your primary, Harry took the test, and I have all his information and kind of what that means. Oh,
Harry Turner 09:04
you said five, which is the head type, right? Uh huh. So the head type is the primary number. That's your primary number. Okay, so the but the head type for anybody else, it would be located in the head type,
Renee Bergmen 09:18
right? So everyone falls in in one number, particularly more than others. You might have a really So what's cool about the anagram is like you'll see the smattering of all the different numbers that you are, and they can help you break down like you'll see how you have different parts of yourself in those different numbers. But what you're looking for is what's the core way that you really deal inland. So that's your one number that tends to when you're answering the question just come out above anything else of the core longing and the core fears that are in core desires. And so that's how your number is sort of determined. And then we have we have body type So we have heart types. And we have head types. And there's three numbers in each of those. And so your your a five, and the five. Let me kind of give you a little rundown of what the five is. Yeah, cuz I'm ready to kind of dive in. Yeah,
Harry Turner 10:15
yeah, yes. Tell me about the five. Tell me about. Tell me about
Renee Bergmen 10:19
your investigative thinker, which as soon as you sent me your, your information, I wasn't surprised at all. I was like, Oh, this makes so much sense that Harry, you're such a deep diver, you want to just get all the investigation going. You want to know all the knowledge, you love to just dive deep. I mean, I remember the first time I was on When Harry Met Daphne, and you had all these books on your shelf right there on your desk while we're talking. And you're like referencing those books while we're talking. So it's just a natural part of who you are. Right? It is kind of this like outpouring of you. And the difficult part for fives is that their core, their core fear is being annihilated or invaded or not existing, being thought and capable or ignorant fives really fear having obligations placed upon you or on your energy that will completely deplete you. And that's the downside of that like real knowledge seeker, as you are afraid that people won't see you as being really capable and smart. And so you just need to keep gaining knowledge, you have fear that you'll kind of people will suck energy from you fives a lot of times we talk about you have mana for the day. And once that man runs out, it's all gone. So five, like certain people have this ability to go, Man, I'm really tired. And then they go, but I'm going to just keep going, I can keep pushing sevens and eights are like that. I'm a seven on the Enneagram it's not a good thing. It's like, I have like pushed myself to exhaustion, which everybody has the ability to do that. But like for fights, usually your day you you have this allotted amount of energy. And so you're always kind of trying to navigate this world of like, where am I giving my energy? And once it runs out, it's really hard for you to like rally and keep going. Does that feel like pretty accurate for who you are?
Harry Turner 12:15
Okay, let me cut out the dramatics. This is just amazing synchronicity. So again, I studied I use a tool of human design right to try to understand myself. And that's the so my title there. What my type there is a mental projector. And as a projector, they said that I had very limited amounts of energy. And that really my interaction with other people should I should limit it to Max 1213 at max four hours a day. The rest of the time is me through me sensing and experiencing the world and reading because I'm designed to consume large quantities of information to
Renee Bergmen 12:51
Yeah, it's crazy amazing. Isn't that just crazy? It it is this one of the things that I think is really cool about the Enneagram. This is a little bit of a tangent, but I think people really find this intriguing. The Enneagram comes from oral tradition. So we actually don't know when it kind of started. And now you know, there's a lot of information that's written down, and there's books and things like that. For a long, long time, like hundreds and hundreds of years, it was all passed through oral tradition, it was passed through hearing, and like listening to your type. So I actually when I learned the Enneagram, I listened to this entire series of Richard Rohr teaching on it. And it was fascinating to listen to who I was, and to have someone really, who was really good at kind of storytelling and, and massaging what all the pieces of it were through auditory exploration, for me to really almost digest it. Because when you're reading something, you're reading for knowledge, but a lot of times when you're listening, you're listening for enrichment. And so there's this interesting thing that happens when you listen to it. So I actually love that we're doing this by podcast because it's so good to listen to for enrichment. I think that we are designed to be someone that is spoken over we're designed to really have people give wisdom and truth over us and some of the best ways to do that is through words right words of affirmation, words of challenge words of love and pushing you to grow all those things come on and are really beautiful when they're done in this way. I
Unknown Speaker 14:29
know I'm with
Renee Bergmen 14:30
you. Okay, let me let me jump back into kind of your your core desires. So we've got core desires and core weakness then core longing, your core desires are being capable and competent, right? And then your your core weakness is avarice. So feeling you lack inner resources and that too much interaction with others will lead to catastrophic depletion. So withholding yourself from contact with the world and holding on to your resources and minimizing your needs. And so that's where some of that needing to find this balance between being with people and being alone. And then it's important for you to understand your core longing is that your needs aren't a problem. And this is like a really good segue into how do you kind of become the number that you are? How does this happen? And I think this is a really good thing for all of us to really think through and think about, like, how do you become who you are, and what shapes you? And we can answer the like, really easy answers of like your parents and teachers and people around you. And then that's all true, but what about being with them, shaped you and changed you and so your needs aren't a problem. As a child, you may have may have had some different childhood messages that were communicated to you. So there's three different childhood messages that all of us have experienced. One is wounding messages. So wounding messages are messages that arrive with an intent to harm or perceive harm. So one of the great examples that I love is like Harry Potter, when Harry Potter in the series, when his Uncle Vernon locks Harry in the closet, his uncle's intent wasn't to correct Harry, or care for Harry, but to be mean and punish him. So that was a very wounding message to Harry. And I like using that example, because it's, it's like, it's a book series, we're not talking about a very specific instance, right? We know in, in real world, like, that's a really, really damaging thing to place a child in a closet, right? So like in the series, it's kind of it's, it's talked about in this kind of floaty way that it's okay. But look, Harry turned out, okay. Yeah, but he wasn't okay. Right? No child should ever be placed in the closet. And so wounding messages, oftentimes people that have had abuse, and so they've received a lot of wounding messages. So like, for my own personal story, it was like, I was actually abused by a parent. And so that that created wounding messages. And so for you, you might have had had some different things that happened. And it's not always a parent, sometimes it's a teacher, sometimes you're like, A, you have a certain personality, and like adults in general kind of respond to you in a certain way, right, like the child can, can perceive things in that way. And so those wounding messages are, are things that get really entwined into our being, right. And so a wounding message for a five ends up being that it's not okay to be comfortable in the world. And so you kind of hide in your books, right, you sort of are looking for a place to hide, you don't feel super comfortable in your world. And so wounding messages can do that. The next one is injuring messages. So injury messages result from something harmful, that happens with no ill intent. So like an enduring message might be a child is sent to the room for a timeout to think about what they've done. And then a parent accidentally forget some of that I've ever done that for my kids when they were little. So like a three year old, and you say, you can't do that you can't break that on purpose. So I want you to go sit in your room and think about it, and then you get busy. And all of a sudden, you're like, oh, my gosh, I left them in there. Well, that child has something that kind of injures them, but it wasn't this like in in the child's didn't feel like you were intentionally going after them necessarily. But there's still something that's left there, right. And injury messages, oftentimes are things that we have an easier time wrapping our mind around and being able to process. So like a wounding message is something that is major trauma that are or minor traumas that our brain can't really process and has a pretty hard time managing. And that's where a lot of difficult voices in your head telling you that you're not enough that you're not good, that you should just go away all those things like some of those messaging, things that we hear in our head that we're pretty embarrassed to ever talk about. We're like injuring messages or something that we're like, Man, I understand that my parents, like did things that were out of wood that weren't out of ill intent. They had some consequences for me, because they're not perfect. And so I've got to work through those. But I don't feel this, like huge need to confront my parents over that. Right? I wouldn't, I wouldn't confront my mom, because she forgot me in a room while I had been punished. And I was like, three, maybe I was a little older. Maybe I was eight. And I remember you forgot to come and talk to me about it. Right now. If that was like a pattern, maybe that was more wounding message, but you get what I'm saying. There's like these things that we perceive as a child and so they do have an impact and a footprint, but our brain has an easier time separating them and navigating through them and being able to cognitively go I understand how that happened and that I can move through About and then influencing good,
Renee Bergmen 15:37
but Oh, no rhyme or stop the flow, you wait. So influencing
Renee Bergmen 18:32
message. So this is the final one. So these are the three ones, the wounding message, the enduring message, and then the influencing message. So the Influencing Message, these are the positive ones. This might be sending a child to a quiet place to help them stop an inappropriate behavior, and they may feel alone at the time, but when they reconnect with the parent, they're reassured that their timeout was for a purpose and that they're loved and cherished. So this is like influencing messages are when your parent really was shining, and did a great job parenting you, and hey, we're going to have a timeout, that was not an okay behavior. But when we come back together, we're going to talk about it. And I'm going to hug you and I'm going to tell you how much I love you. And I'm going to tell you that I always forgive you, and that my love is never conditional upon what you do. And so those influencing messages are the messages that have the power to just really create a dynamic adult, right? There's a message we really want to give to our kids.
Harry Turner 21:09
So there's four styles of parenting. Well, 111 theory is put together four styles of parenting, but the authoritative is what it sounds like, not the authoritarian style, but the authoritative where there's an equal amount of expectations, but at the same time, that nurturing is still there.
Renee Bergmen 21:26
Right? Because discipline is still important. Like you still you need a discipline as a child, but sometimes our, you know, different adults in our life, their form of discipline was not done well. And so that's when we see those wounding messages, those enduring messages and those influencing messages.
Harry Turner 21:42
Yes, yes. Okay. All right. Well, I'm learning.
Harry Turner 21:49
With you, you're seeking a life coach. Nocturnal therapist is the name and mental alchemy is the game. If you want to understand how to transmute, transform, and transcend these challenges AND these challenging emotions, FIND me at the School of outliers at becomeanoutlier.com/links. Again, that's becomeanoutlier.com/links. Stay LIT and Agape.
Renee Bergmen 22:16
so tell me what you think about all that? How's that? How's that flow for you? When you kind of reflect let's know about Harry, do you have any things that pop into your mind?
Harry Turner 22:25
That's exactly what I'm about to hit on when you say wounding messages, because I'm taking notes, all the wounding messages, injury messages and fluency messages, water warning messages, and in any example that you gave, it's not okay to be comfortable in the world. And so I had set with that as you were talking, I was like, what was not okay, my mind. My mind, always thought differently. And in that was definitely groomed by my parents. They supported that even though they could only understand to a certain extent, but even yet, as parents, they could only stand to a certain extent being out there and mom get asked me to come play out when you come in out there and play with us, man, and, and I respond to them with a Shakespearean quote. kids weren't really.
Renee Bergmen 23:11
Yeah, kids, well, I'm here you have this like big structure of a man, and I'm sure you had some of that, even as a kid, that people are gonna think, oh, what sports you play? And you're like, I read books. Right? Yeah, there's there's some pain in that. There's not like an intentionality necessarily, obviously, I don't know your parents. And so everybody, you kind of have to, like evaluate what's there intentionally, because sometimes there is intentionality when abuse has happened. But most times, it's not intentional. It's, I think you touched on it. It was confusion, it was misunderstanding of I don't, I don't understand my child. Because I'm not like this.
Harry Turner 23:56
And what I learned here are unique. And this is what so blessed with where I'm so blessed to be a therapist and then continue to go deeper when I learned about complex PTSD. And if you look into complex PTSD work, right, I believe it's in there. One of the things that they have listed under traumas besides like military losses, natural disasters, and whatever else you would think would be a trauma being misunderstood. I said, Well, I'll be I have never in any book ever heard someone list being misunderstood as a trauma, but because it had it in there, I looked at it and I was like, That's it. Yep, that that probably influenced my behaviors with other people more than anything else. The big the big t's the little tick the one these were a bunch of little T's, but even more so than the big t's the big traumas, what we consider big traumas. Yeah, yeah. So yeah, definitely. It definitely that one about it's not okay to be comfortable in the world. That one definitely range true. It's not okay for me to express my ideas. It's not okay. It's not okay to be an outlier.
Renee Bergmen 24:56
Yeah. And fives the message that fives really need to hear their childhood message they need to hear is your needs aren't a problem. And I think that's because as fives you probably were a complicated child, because you are always like, looking for more information. And you're probably asking a lot of questions, you are probably a really great question asker, you probably really wanted to know how things worked and functioned. Maybe you even inserted yourselves into adult conversations more than, than other children. Right? And but then what happens is like when kids are like that, as a five, they're sort of pushed aside, right? Because in general, we push kids aside, we think you don't have anything to add to this conversation right now. And so you get you, you understand, I need to take care of my own needs. And so as an adult, you've got to work on my needs aren't a problem. It's okay to let people deal with my problems. I think back to you telling me about you going to Sedona when you kind of had just like a break, mentally, and you probably went in went away by yourself. Correct.
Harry Turner 26:06
I was going to go away, but my wife stopped me and she came with me. Okay,
Renee Bergmen 26:11
that's a good woman.
Harry Turner 26:15
Yes, she is. She's a great woman, the best one?
Renee Bergmen 26:19
Yeah. And that's what you needed. You needed a partner to come alongside you and say, your problems and you're breaking right now, that's not a problem, I want to be alongside you. And that's the beautiful work when you really get into the nitty gritty of some of the Enneagram stuff, but even just who we are as people, we all need someone that's willing to come alongside us and say you're not, you're not too much. I love everything about you, even your broken side. And I'm willing to walk through things with you and your broken side, especially if you're willing to work, right? Like you're willing to do the work, man, it just it can do some phenomenal things in a relationship.
Harry Turner 26:59
So will you say that, and I guess they're thinking about this as well. It's, it's not okay to be comfortable in the world. I have had a natural ability to have people become comfortable around me. People just naturally get comfortable around me. Babies go to sleep, when I come in the room like pets go to sleep, when I come in the room, like everybody starts feeling safe. And I come in the room, right? And throughout my life, people rely on me for information. So I was always like that natural guide, or therapists or whatever, teacher, I was always that friend that they reached out to and so part of the pain was, who can I reach out to? Yeah, cool, understand my burden, my pain me my scars. And then of course, there were experiences where attempts were made. And of course, what you don't understand you fear. When you truly don't understand if I'm not coming at you, a lot of people, if you stay surface level, if I'm not coming at you with a situation that's very common, or in thinking about a situation is very common, then what throws people off, I'll never forget my father. He said we were in public somewhere. And he said, he don't know what got into me. But he said, I stood up on a bench, and I just begin talking. This is the child I don't even remember it. But he said I stood up on a bench and I began talking. And my my father didn't play like you, you you behave in public, you definitely stand up on on a bench. So he don't know what got into me that caused me to stand up on the bench. But he said, I began to speak. And he said when I started to speak, a crowd got around. And he said, I couldn't even stop you. I didn't even really notice the crowd was forming. Because I know no matter what he knew he would react quickly if he thought we were out of line. And he definitely thought me standing on the bench was out of line. But he said that what I was hearing you speak it sounded like you were like in your 60s and 70s. I think I think I might have been like eight 910 Something like that. And he and he said that's what caused the crowd the adults to farm as well because they couldn't figure out how is this coming out of this child? Well, I got news for everybody. I don't know how it's coming to this.
Renee Bergmen 28:59
Yeah, yeah. And those are such defining moments in our life, it's not surprising that you went into the field that you went into.
Harry Turner 29:09
Right? I learned that through. Also through human design, it said that I would be great as some type of leader or life coach therapist, and it also said I'm designed to filter people's energies through me and so I need to be aware of that. And so when I feel an energy that's not like baseline because my baseline is calm and neutral. If I'm feeling these intense emotions first question to ask myself is does this emotion even belong to me? Yeah, I was it legit said I was just I'm a mental projector. And this is what tripped me out. This projectors. But then a mental projector is like a subtype under that, where literally what's lit up is my throat, my throat chakra and my mind. And so according to human design, I was born to deliver a message and I have Yes, yeah, no, it's it's crazy. And now I'm here on this podcast. As I'm talking to you, I'm learning about my Enneagram and wounding messages entering messages and fluency messages like this is investigative, investigative. Thank you. This isn't, please. Is there any? Is there anything else that stood out to you in? Wow, while I have you let me go on on and let me get you expertise on this? What does it mean by like body type? What does that mean to be a body type? Yeah, what does it mean like when it goes into.
Renee Bergmen 30:26
So when you go into the types, so we have a head type, a heart type, and a body type. So body types are driven by instinct, and are in tune with their five senses. So it's how they're their primary means of gathering information. So body types are eight nines and ones. And for body types, typically, their core emotion is anger. So that doesn't necessarily mean that all body types experience anger frequently. It's just that some people who are body tapes repress their anger. And so they physically are very, they feel a lot. However, it's still a driving force in their thoughts and actions. And eights are pretty aggressive. eights in general, are the more bold and they like to fight. That's how they feel loved, where nines are pretty reserved, and kind of like hold back, but both of them when they are, like tipped off, anger is just like what comes out. And same with one. So ones are really, they like everything in order, they're very detailed, there's only one right way way to do things are very black and white. So like justice oriented things for one, they're going to react very physically. So there's, it's a real physical eights, nines and ones are very physically reactive to the world. And so you also see like eights, nines, and ones tend to like to be in their bodies, like their eight nines, and ones typically like, like a sport, they like to ride their bike, they like to do something physical, it feels really good to them to like physically use their body.
Harry Turner 32:08
Because I'm gonna wait, I'm gonna want your five, what the body the body type,
Renee Bergmen 32:13
oh, of your body type. Yeah, so of your body type your your highest was a one, you're a 77%. And you probably it doesn't mean that you necessarily are a one, that means you just have pieces of that. So you probably are someone that has some gut sensing, you probably use your gut to kind of feel things and sense things. But typically, as a head type, because you're a head type, you're really driven by intellect and the tend to analyze and rationalize your emotions. So like when you have emotions, you're not physically feeling it, you want to come to a conclusion. So five, set six, and sevens are all head types. So I'm in the head type category as well. So I'm, I'm a thinker. So like, when emotions come up, I want to think about them first. And I want to analyze why they're happening before I want to actually feel them and deal with them. And so fives as well, fives are going to be more driven, that they're your resources scarce, that you don't have enough. And you're going to use your brain to kind of like, solve problems and emotions.
Harry Turner 33:21
I get it. So depending on where you score at, that breaks down, whether what whether you're a head type, heart type, or body type, and so we're under the umbrella, five, six and seven. They're under the umbrella of Yes, head to head type. Yeah, gotcha. You're
Renee Bergmen 33:36
five. So when you when you do all of the different percentages of all numbers, all nine numbers, your five is a 98%. You're like totally fine. That's, that's your just core longing. When I take the test. I'm a 99.5%. Seven. It's like hilarious. And not everybody's like that. Not everybody is as as extreme. I think that fives and sevens and general and threes. So threes, fives and sevens tend to be the extreme, because we're kind of the extreme of the INIA gram where those numbers that are sort of extreme like you're the extreme head. I'm the extreme of just going all the time and wanting to experience all the things in the world. I just I want to take in as much as I can and have the woods all the experiences that I can possibly have. When I'm on vacation. I'm thinking about my next vacation. I'm planning the next one. It drives my husband bonkers, because we just be on this vacation. I'm like, I know. But look, there's a sale for like in six months to come back here. And you stop just be here at this vacation.
Harry Turner 34:40
Yeah, and I'm noticing that mine is pretty high too for seven I think is that.
Renee Bergmen 34:45
Yeah, so this is interesting. So in the Enneagram you have different pathways. So in in unhealth so fives when you're really stressed, a five goes to seven and unhealth so you take on some of the seven characteristics that's why that says NS probably high it shows pretty high because a five kind of goes towards that seven unhealthy suit. A five when you're like not dealing with stuff and you're you haven't done your work, you tend to have a bit of a racing mind you're a little more scattered and restless. You tend to overbook, your schedule, you take on too many new projects impulsively, you might become unfocused and distracted, you're a little less patient with people. And you might become like, radically absorbed with learning everything at a feverish pace. So, probably in some of your most unhealthy moments, when you're struggling with some like emotional things, your your reaction was to like, just learn, learn, learn, learn, learn, learn, learn, learn, learn. Now those things can be turned to a positive, but it's some of that unhealth. So you go to that seven, in unhealth, but then in health, you go to an eight, which is interesting. And so the eight, which the eight you become eights are really confident people. And so you take on some of their like self confidence and assertiveness, more decisive, you're a little more active in your body, you take on some of the bodily stuff, you connect more with your emotions and your gut instincts. That's where some of that guttural comes from, you are better at trusting your own instincts, becoming bolder and quicker to take action. So less moving out of just the knowledge and just having it but like actually acting in that knowledge, you're willing to act in the knowledge. Yeah, become less isolated and more grounded in experiencing you just from the times that we've talked, I can tell you've done work. Because I can tell that you don't just learn things and hoard it. You're not a knowledge hoarder, you're in this space of like, how do I share this? How do I use that voice. And so fives, when they can do their work, it's really phenomenal to watch them be able to just share so much knowledge, they have so much to share. They're so good at digesting the knowledge and projecting it out and giving it to the world. So you're doing that.
Harry Turner 37:06
That's literally if you study Human Design, that's why they call it Mental Projector. My understanding is you died, you consume all of this information. And then you put it together and projecting a new image, which is maybe just a little bit higher, not a little bit a lot a bit higher, but a higher frequency. Yeah, just because there's things that we need to solve in this world as global warming, there's the pandemic of loneliness, and why the epidemic, so many people are experiencing that. And we are projecting them blaming each other. And there's a there's a different, there's a different route, but we don't try love so. So we get people to understand that this isn't some woowoo stuff. Yeah, there's a lot of people out there to talk about woowoo stuff and whatever, whatever. I only talk on things that I actually believe in. And if I believe in it, I mean, I did some work studying it, you know, I mean, it's as a true student of life, I feel a connection and more obligation, I'd say, to put that that word out there to teach to help liberate Ignis exist. So
Renee Bergmen 38:10
I think I think it's interesting, you you touch on this like idea of people saying things being woowoo. And out there, when you when you pull that thread of someone that that is moved by something that feels outside of their consciousness and whatnot. Oftentimes, when you pull that thread, what it's really getting at is this desire to understand themselves, right, and to understand what is happening in their world around them. And so sometimes it comes out in a wonky way. And you're like, Okay, well, I can dream that I have a million dollars since and manifest, I'm going to be rich, but it's not actually going to happen unless I do some work. Right? And so there's this manifestation of like, why why do you want to manifest that? What does that manifestation pulling at it typically, it's some kind of childhood wounding, some kind of, like lack of care that has been given lack of protection or resources. And so really, like a lot of times those woowoo things you're like, if you pull that thread, you can actually get to the core of, there's a longing there. And if you would do some work on that, that will can really lead you towards some really phenomenal coming into yourself and into healing. And you've got to do the work though. Right? So like that. I think that's where that woowoo word even comes from if people don't want to do the work. And so they're like, if I just think it, it'll happen. Now, you got to actually do the work. So you gotta like, get down in there. You got to deal with emotions. Find a professional that knows how to pull things out of you and help work through stuff. But man, maybe you can do the work and become a millionaire if that's what your manifestation you want that manifestation to be. But because you did the work, and you figure out who you're supposed to be, and you find out like what you're supposed to give to the world and not giving up the world produces financial resource, right?
Harry Turner 40:05
Yes. Yes, the manifestation. And for those of y'all who were really seeking to understand manifestation real quick, I'll tell you that what it really is is just a sexier way of saying cause and effect.
Renee Bergmen 40:18
Harry Turner 40:21
Because intention now this is why I said a code is is a code for everything like the code for water is h2o. My code for manifestation is combining thought word. And the Gandhi said Happiness is when we combine thought word indeed. And so what manifestation is whenever you take that energy of thought, and then transform for it to affirm that reality through your words. And when you begin to respond to that reality, that's a lot of intentionality that you're being done that's being done a lot of energy being poured into something that yet does not exist. But again, we have attention goes, energy flows, and we know that everything consists of energy. So the more that you stare at this thing and intentionally respond to it, you're queuing to light that this is real for you. And so perception is reality. And so the more you stare at that, the more you respond to it, eventually, it collapses from the metaphysical to the physical plane. But that's, that's the magic of intentionality, reflects relationship and manifestation. But it requires you dancing with life, and you making a choice and consistently choosing that, and you'll find that your pet goes all over the place. I didn't expect to be on podcast talking to my sister right now. Like, you go all over the place. But again, it's not. It's not how you get there. It's just that you get there. And it's even, it's not even about the destination. It's about the process the way that you traveled. So that's what I'm saying, don't get you're gonna get there, wherever there is for you, you won't get there. But really, this moment right now was meant for you to just be present and enjoy the process and understand what's being refined in and being pulled out through this process.
Renee Bergmen 41:52
Yeah, no, totally.
Harry Turner 41:53
Sister. Oh, my goodness, this is so any any last takeaway? Do we have anything else we like, we got it. I think
Renee Bergmen 42:01
I love coaching people through this stuff. And so if you're interested in in like diving in, I do this as well. So all of my clients, I work through the Enneagram, when we're working on physical, emotional pieces are such a big part of our physical illness. But sometimes I just have people that they're like, I just really want to go deeper into my Enneagram. And so I coached them all through that and we really pull all the strings. I mean, we go down every growth path down every what happens when you're unhealthy. How do we really hold those strings and start to see some progress in relationship and, and what's amazing is so I just had an Enneagram coaching call today with someone. And what's amazing is how physically, you start to feel some relief when you do some of the the emotional work. Now it's not the whole thing that they're all intertwined. You got to do both. You got to do all the work that work on your things that you're doing throughout your day. Are you giving yourself good nourishment? Are you making sure you move your body and things like that, but if your mind is not okay, and your heart is not okay, it doesn't matter how much you work out or what the heck you eat, it will do nothing for you. You've got it, you gotta deal with the heart stuff and the head stuff. Those pieces are just your body is just so integrated, you can't pull them apart. And when you try to, you end up just a mess and going I don't know why I still feel terrible. So if you're interested, I love to do Enneagram coaching. It's such a great tool to even understand do I have physical things that I need to work on as well?
Harry Turner 43:46
Yeah. Thank you so much for being on the show. And I appreciate it. So y'all got into mind y'all got into my Enneagram today and you were definitely hitting all some points and gave me some insight you gave me some stuff to to chew on to think about but he I'd see the parallels between this and what I've been studying about myself through the design and that occurred and my last like state of depression was the last last January February, January, February and I started to get out of it towards the end of February into March. But yeah, the things that you said this, this entire episode this entire session and not knowing that my needs are not a burden trusting that I could be open and vulnerable with with with someone in them not break. You know, I mean, like these things, it's real. It's real. It's real. So I appreciate you so much sister. I will say again, people you can find her at WWW dot megaphone, functional health.com Renee at megaphone health functional health.com is the email and Instagram and Facebook megaphone functional health. Check out make sure you like our pages, make sure you follow us sign up for them. mailing lists. And if you want to understand more about Enneagram if you want to go deep into your Enneagram, I would definitely encourage you to seek her services out so she can go deeper into that because until the unconscious becomes conscious, it will direct your life and you will call it fate. And so to the outlier community, I just appreciate y'all thank you for supporting me. Thank you for listening to me and hopefully this this session. I know it's been beneficial for me. Hopefully it's been similarly beneficial for y'all continue to live in truth. Oh, and don't forget, we have the become an outlier.com/links. Go there and get your free guide to shadow work. I got a lot of free things out there free meditations free guide to Shadow Work. Check me out and I'm just warming up. I'm lukewarm right now. You're about to see it in a second. I'm about to be blazing. But check this out. Become an ally.com/links. appreciate y'all stay lit stay living in your truth. Stay living in truth. stay lit agape.